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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  Dromoda on Wed Aug 07, 2013 4:09 am

United States of Europe wrote:
Dromoda wrote:
United States of Europe wrote:Demilitarization is something too heavy, would ultimately weigh heavily on Russia.
Would seize virtually reduced to a colony.
The Russian people would not accept it, and rise up against us.
We see this as "colonizers" and this could be exploited for the benefit of Stalin and his government.
Instead, the Russian people must see us as liberators by the totalitarian dictatorship.
We must make sure that the entire government to resign Stalin, and start a process of democratization in Russia.
Above all, once democratized, we should increase investment in economic Russiaper to develop the economy and create a good state apparatus.
In this way, the Russian people certainly sympathize with us.
In addition, we should have more covenants and friendship with that country.
In this way, protremo better control of the nation, and tighten the belt in case of problems.
If we do this, probably the Russian people will accept a place on our military presence, with an international basis.

The base would be open to international forces of the nations that participated in the mission against Russia, even those who have not joined officially and Shirouma.
Preferably, the place should be allocated Rapid Deployment Forces of the WAAF, if nations are membre of the organization.

What do you think?

well we dont agree with the democratization part

 We have to do it, is a must.
The Russian people not appreciate a smitilarizzazione and a foreign presence in their national soil.
May arise, and Stalin would take advantage to strengthen his powers, increase its consensus and act against us once again.
Unless we do something for the Russian people.
So bring down the dictatorship, by dismissing the current government, and initiate a process of democratization.
Then, invest resources in Russia to make it develop economically and to create a good state apparatus.
In this way, we will check the best government of the new democratic Russia, and the people will see us as liberators.
So, we can safely maintain a massive military presence in that country.
In addition, we do not risk it a return to the government of Stalin, and not even revolutions and revolts in his name.


well a good state does not have to be an democracy. we Dromodians are no democracy and look our economy and the freedoms our people enjoy. i mean that a dictator could be a good one and could care for its people if he wants to. our leader does.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  United States of Europe on Wed Aug 07, 2013 4:17 am

Dromoda wrote:
United States of Europe wrote:
Dromoda wrote:
United States of Europe wrote:Demilitarization is something too heavy, would ultimately weigh heavily on Russia.
Would seize virtually reduced to a colony.
The Russian people would not accept it, and rise up against us.
We see this as "colonizers" and this could be exploited for the benefit of Stalin and his government.
Instead, the Russian people must see us as liberators by the totalitarian dictatorship.
We must make sure that the entire government to resign Stalin, and start a process of democratization in Russia.
Above all, once democratized, we should increase investment in economic Russiaper to develop the economy and create a good state apparatus.
In this way, the Russian people certainly sympathize with us.
In addition, we should have more covenants and friendship with that country.
In this way, protremo better control of the nation, and tighten the belt in case of problems.
If we do this, probably the Russian people will accept a place on our military presence, with an international basis.

The base would be open to international forces of the nations that participated in the mission against Russia, even those who have not joined officially and Shirouma.
Preferably, the place should be allocated Rapid Deployment Forces of the WAAF, if nations are membre of the organization.

What do you think?

well we dont agree with the democratization part

 We have to do it, is a must.
The Russian people not appreciate a smitilarizzazione and a foreign presence in their national soil.
May arise, and Stalin would take advantage to strengthen his powers, increase its consensus and act against us once again.
Unless we do something for the Russian people.
So bring down the dictatorship, by dismissing the current government, and initiate a process of democratization.
Then, invest resources in Russia to make it develop economically and to create a good state apparatus.
In this way, we will check the best government of the new democratic Russia, and the people will see us as liberators.
So, we can safely maintain a massive military presence in that country.
In addition, we do not risk it a return to the government of Stalin, and not even revolutions and revolts in his name.


well a good state does not have to be an democracy. we Dromodians are no democracy and look our economy and the freedoms our people enjoy. i mean that a dictator could be a good one and could care for its people if he wants to. our leader does.

 However, we have to make sure to bring down the government of Stalin, in this way Russia will have a new government that will initiate a period of development and prosperity for the citizens, even with our subsidies.
The Russian people will have sympathy for us, and we will avoid protests, riots and revolutions in the name of Stalin that could destabilize the situation.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  New Tarajan on Wed Aug 07, 2013 6:11 am

I agree both with Dromoda and Europe.
With Dromoda, because we think that a democratization is not so necessary; with Europe, because I believe the line he designed is the best opportunity to finally stabilize the situation.
Until now, New Tarajan insisted with the demilitarization of Russia, as a fundamental part of the surrender. However, I have to admit Europe has a good point fearing that internationa pressure on demilitarization could be a weapon in the hands of the Stalin.
So, we are ready to withdraw our initial proposal, eventually replacing it with a simple reduction of military forces, especially regarding the capabilities of long-range attacks.
Also, we could create a mission or special commission of the World Development Bank, devoted to the economic development of Russia, to side with the WAAF mission, which will have also a civilian side, in order to help what Europe said on the opportunity to let Russian people see us as liberators.
About the government, we believe the actual communist nomenklatura cannot be let in charge. However, as we said before, this doesn't necessarilty mean democratization. Simply, the responsibles of the attack must be put in front of the justice.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  United States of Europe on Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:17 am

New Tarajan wrote:I agree both with Dromoda and Europe.
With Dromoda, because we think that a democratization is not so necessary; with Europe, because I believe the line he designed is the best opportunity to finally stabilize the situation.
Until now, New Tarajan insisted with the demilitarization of Russia, as a fundamental part of the surrender. However, I have to admit Europe has a good point fearing that internationa pressure on demilitarization could be a weapon in the hands of the Stalin.
So, we are ready to withdraw our initial proposal, eventually replacing it with a simple reduction of military forces, especially regarding the capabilities of long-range attacks.
Also, we could create a mission or special commission of the World Development Bank, devoted to the economic development of Russia, to side with the WAAF mission, which will have also a civilian side, in order to help what Europe said on the opportunity to let Russian people see us as liberators.
About the government, we believe the actual communist nomenklatura cannot be let in charge. However, as we said before, this doesn't necessarilty mean democratization. Simply, the responsibles of the attack must be put in front of the justice.

 We are happy with the position taken by New Tarajan.
In addition, Eurussia protested about the area in which to build a military base internationally.
In fact, this area is within Russia, and this would violate their sovereignty, going out from the principles of WAAF.
So, I think the military base WAAF international must always be placed in a strategic area for that region, but in an international area, so it does not contravene any sovereignty.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  Texania on Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:39 am

United States of Europe wrote:
New Tarajan wrote:I agree both with Dromoda and Europe.
With Dromoda, because we think that a democratization is not so necessary; with Europe, because I believe the line he designed is the best opportunity to finally stabilize the situation.
Until now, New Tarajan insisted with the demilitarization of Russia, as a fundamental part of the surrender. However, I have to admit Europe has a good point fearing that internationa pressure on demilitarization could be a weapon in the hands of the Stalin.
So, we are ready to withdraw our initial proposal, eventually replacing it with a simple reduction of military forces, especially regarding the capabilities of long-range attacks.
Also, we could create a mission or special commission of the World Development Bank, devoted to the economic development of Russia, to side with the WAAF mission, which will have also a civilian side, in order to help what Europe said on the opportunity to let Russian people see us as liberators.
About the government, we believe the actual communist nomenklatura cannot be let in charge. However, as we said before, this doesn't necessarilty mean democratization. Simply, the responsibles of the attack must be put in front of the justice.

 We are happy with the position taken by New Tarajan.
In addition, Eurussia protested about the area in which to build a military base internationally.
In fact, this area is within Russia, and this would violate their sovereignty, going out from the principles of WAAF.
So, I think the military base WAAF international must always be placed in a strategic area for that region, but in an international area, so it does not contravene any sovereignty.

See my post in the news network.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  Federation of Antanares on Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:48 am

We must help Russia and I agree with the position of other members of the WAAF. But recently I see that Eurussia doesn't approve our move and Texania move in another base the troops. I thinks is necessary now demonstrate that we are not an invasion force but only friends who want to help them to get out from the regime of Stalin and his brutality, his inefficiency and his weakness.
I think, after the deploy of our troops in the new base, we can suggest to use our forces like police corps, help in reconstruction with our equipments and vehicles.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  Great Eurussia on Wed Aug 07, 2013 10:37 am

Federation of Antanares wrote:We must help Russia and I agree with the position of other members of the WAAF. But recently I see that Eurussia doesn't approve our move and Texania move in another base the troops. I thinks is necessary now demonstrate that we are not an invasion force but only friends who want to help them to get out from the regime of Stalin and his brutality, his inefficiency and his weakness.
I think, after the deploy of our troops in the new base, we can suggest to use our forces like police corps, help in reconstruction with our equipments and vehicles.

Eurussia is a responsible member of the WAAF and we wish to protect the dignity of the WAAF by advising that its presence on Russian soil is a clear violation of sovereignty because the forces are unwanted in that country and there is no SC approved military intervention.
Furthermore, we object any move to interfere with the internal affairs of Ultra Nationalist Russia since the WAAF is risking another blatant violation of constitutional right of an independent state which is the right to non-interference. However, if there is indeed a great call for the change of leadership in communist Russia, then the pressure must come from the international community by way of SC imposed sanctions and charge their leader in Court.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  Texania on Wed Aug 07, 2013 11:19 am

Great Eurussia wrote:
Federation of Antanares wrote:We must help Russia and I agree with the position of other members of the WAAF. But recently I see that Eurussia doesn't approve our move and Texania move in another base the troops. I thinks is necessary now demonstrate that we are not an invasion force but only friends who want to help them to get out from the regime of Stalin and his brutality, his inefficiency and his weakness.
I think, after the deploy of our troops in the new base, we can suggest to use our forces like police corps, help in reconstruction with our equipments and vehicles.

Eurussia is a responsible member of the WAAF and we wish to protect the dignity of the WAAF by advising that its presence on Russian soil is a clear violation of sovereignty because the forces are unwanted in that country and there is no SC approved military intervention.
Furthermore, we object any move to interfere with the internal affairs of Ultra Nationalist Russia since the WAAF is risking another blatant violation of constitutional right of an independent state which is the right to non-interference. However, if there is indeed a great call for the change of leadership in communist Russia, then the pressure must come from the international community by way of SC imposed sanctions and charge their leader in Court.

I think you arent understanding,The base is to be used as a fast deployment to Anything that need's to be assisted to,Earthquakes,disasters,wars...etc
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  Great Eurussia on Wed Aug 07, 2013 11:33 am

Texania wrote:
Great Eurussia wrote:
Federation of Antanares wrote:We must help Russia and I agree with the position of other members of the WAAF. But recently I see that Eurussia doesn't approve our move and Texania move in another base the troops. I thinks is necessary now demonstrate that we are not an invasion force but only friends who want to help them to get out from the regime of Stalin and his brutality, his inefficiency and his weakness.
I think, after the deploy of our troops in the new base, we can suggest to use our forces like police corps, help in reconstruction with our equipments and vehicles.

Eurussia is a responsible member of the WAAF and we wish to protect the dignity of the WAAF by advising that its presence on Russian soil is a clear violation of sovereignty because the forces are unwanted in that country and there is no SC approved military intervention.
Furthermore, we object any move to interfere with the internal affairs of Ultra Nationalist Russia since the WAAF is risking another blatant violation of constitutional right of an independent state which is the right to non-interference. However, if there is indeed a great call for the change of leadership in communist Russia, then the pressure must come from the international community by way of SC imposed sanctions and charge their leader in Court.

I think you arent understanding,The base is to be used as a fast deployment to Anything that need's to be assisted to,Earthquakes,disasters,wars...etc

Eurussia understands these needs. If the WAAF agrees with us, our government could propose designating portions of neutral lands in the World Alliance for faster deployments where one particular zone per each continent. However, these lands must be designated as World Alliance Neutral Zone that could technically serve as hubs for the operations of Security Council authorized regional organizations such as the WAAF, WAPF, and the WASDA.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  New Tarajan on Thu Aug 08, 2013 2:53 am

A more practical solutions would be to ask to WAAF Member States to designate bases and facilities to be used by WAAF-only contingents. It would less "invasive" of the regional geography.

Regarding the Russian situation, we understand, and appreciate, the Eurussian intervention, alongside the diplomatic pressure. However, we have to admit that, until now, there isn't been any significant progress: ok, Russia have accepted to surrender, but under what conditions? Nothing, practically.
The government of Stalin is still governing the State, and the responsibles of the attack are still sitting comfortably on their seats.
The WAAF have to demonstrate to be liberators, not conquerors...but must also ensure the respect of International Law. We don't see, for the moment, any practical plan to achieve the judgement of the WA Court of Justice on Stalin and his government.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  United States of Europe on Thu Aug 08, 2013 4:10 am

First of all, I would say that we can begin assembling the international military base in the area indicated by Texania.
I also think that for the moment, the air and sea blockade should be maintained, as well as continue to maintain Shirouma deployed in the Rapid Deployment Forces.
The Russia surrendered, but has not yet paid.
In this way, we avoid possible invasions.
So, given that both the Court of Justice that the Security Council are disabled at this time, due to the Constitutional Convention, the WAAF is the only means by which to pressure Stalin, for him and his government to resign and be processed.
Shirouma must get justice.
If the WAAF can not do this, we ask our good ally Eurussia not wait more and activate the Security Council against Russia.
We can not wait any longer.
We also agree with the words of New Tarajan.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  Federation of Antanares on Thu Aug 08, 2013 4:48 am

Antanares thinks we must react to the action of Stalin and his government. Russia must pay for the war that caused. For that we think is necessary a fast intervention of the Security Council, that is active during this day, in spite of the assembly for the reform of our constitution.
We suggest a diplomatic intervention that enforce Stalin to abandon the power and use the WAAF for ensure new free election. Also, Antanares support the idea of an international base outside of the territory of Russia from that launch humanitarian missions and support the nation in this difficult period of transition.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  United States of Europe on Thu Aug 08, 2013 5:05 am

Federation of Antanares wrote:Antanares thinks we must react to the action of Stalin and his government. Russia must pay for the war that caused. For that we think is necessary a fast intervention of the Security Council, that is active during this day, in spite of the assembly for the reform of our constitution.
We suggest a diplomatic intervention that enforce Stalin to abandon the power and use the WAAF for ensure new free election. Also, Antanares support the idea of an international base outside of the territory of Russia from that launch humanitarian missions and support the nation in this difficult period of transition.

Exactly, this is what we want.
At this point, the WAAF has done everything in his power.
Now it's Eurussia and the Security Council ensure justice in Russia.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  New Tarajan on Thu Aug 08, 2013 6:00 am

We greatly thanks United States of Europe and Antanares for their support.
Also, we agree with them on the possibility of a direct intervention of the Eurussia and the Security Council.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  Great Eurussia on Thu Aug 08, 2013 12:03 pm

New Tarajan wrote:A more practical solutions would be to ask to WAAF Member States to designate bases and facilities to be used by WAAF-only contingents. It would less "invasive" of the regional geography.

Regarding the Russian situation, we understand, and appreciate, the Eurussian intervention, alongside the diplomatic pressure. However, we have to admit that, until now, there isn't been any significant progress: ok, Russia have accepted to surrender, but under what conditions? Nothing, practically.
The government of Stalin is still governing the State, and the responsibles of the attack are still sitting comfortably on their seats.
The WAAF have to demonstrate to be liberators, not conquerors...but must also ensure the respect of International Law. We don't see, for the moment, any practical plan to achieve the judgement of the WA Court of Justice on Stalin and his government.

Because Ultra Nationalist Russia is a sovereign independent state of the World Alliance.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  New-Zealand on Thu Aug 08, 2013 1:15 pm

*The NZ Envoy finally arrives*

"Sorry, NZ wasn't actually planning on joining, but we got a request from the Europa Delegate... so yeah, here I am. Sorry I'm late "
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  New Tarajan on Thu Aug 08, 2013 8:34 pm

Russia is trying to support the growth of its economy, said the more recent news.
This give us an opportunity to help them.
However, we cannot let them to increase their weapon production and the reinforcements to their army, not before Stalin and his nomenklatura have been put in front of the Court for their responsabilities.
My proposal is to offer the WAAF aid for first-needs goods, and to directly aid the growht of food production, but to give an halt to weapon production, conditioning its reprisal to the end of the actual Stalin government.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  Federation of Antanares on Thu Aug 08, 2013 8:39 pm

I agree with New Tarajan. We must stop Stalin before he started to ream his armies. We must act now.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  Great Eurussia on Thu Aug 08, 2013 8:46 pm

Eurussia requests the WAAF to justify its plans on preventing the Communist Russian Government for developing its arms industry. Unless unjustified, our government believes that the WAAF is becoming the aggressor and violating the rights of a sovereign state.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  New Tarajan on Thu Aug 08, 2013 10:00 pm

Great Eurussia wrote:
Eurussia requests the WAAF to justify its plans on preventing the Communist Russian Government for developing its arms industry. Unless unjustified, our government believes that the WAAF is becoming the aggressor and violating the rights of a sovereign state.

We perfectly understand your position, Eurussia.
And we want to justify our position: the Ultranationalist government has demonstrated its aggressive intentions by attacking Shirouma without any provocation. I think all of us can easily agree on this point.
So, it is comprehensble that us, as allies of Shirouma, are worried about a production program specifically designed to provide new and more powerful weapons to the Ultranationalist army.
Under normal circumstances, no one would have had nothing to object, since, as you said, Russia is an independent, sovereign State; but these are not normal circumstances: we don't have any assurance of the pacific intentions of Stalin, on the contrary, we can reasonably suspect that there are hostile plans lying behind the Russian government, since the actual situation.
Russia is a sovereign State, but it seems to me that it hasn't paid anything, for the moment, for its aggression; nothing changed, and, until nothing will chance, in conscience we cannot let an aggressive government to increase its army power.
It would be an insult to Shirouma, and a possible threat to the region.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  Great Eurussia on Thu Aug 08, 2013 10:31 pm

If that is the case, Eurussia believes that diplomats must be sent to Communist Russia to relay our concerns and even invite their government to join the WAAF to convince their government to be transparent and coordinative with the international community. We must not always use force with force and sword with sword to achieve peace.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  New Tarajan on Thu Aug 08, 2013 10:55 pm

Great Eurussia wrote:
If that is the case, Eurussia believes that diplomats must be sent to Communist Russia to relay our concerns and even invite their government to join the WAAF to convince their government to be transparent and coordinative with the international community. We must not always use force with force and sword with sword to achieve peace.
Without doubts we have to rely also on diplomacy.
But an invite in the WAAF would be, in the opinion of the Royal government, premature.
It could result in th paralysys of any future operation the WAAF should be obliged to take against Russia. We cannot simply admit them here without guarantees.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  Great Eurussia on Thu Aug 08, 2013 11:21 pm

New Tarajan wrote:
Great Eurussia wrote:
If that is the case, Eurussia believes that diplomats must be sent to Communist Russia to relay our concerns and even invite their government to join the WAAF to convince their government to be transparent and coordinative with the international community. We must not always use force with force and sword with sword to achieve peace.
Without doubts we have to rely also on diplomacy.
But an invite in the WAAF would be, in the opinion of the Royal government, premature.
It could result in th paralysys of any future operation the WAAF should be obliged to take against Russia. We cannot simply admit them here without guarantees.
On that note, Eurussia supports New Tarajan.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  United States of Europe on Thu Aug 08, 2013 11:23 pm

For the moment, all that the WAAF is able to do is keep active the air and sea blockade, keep operating the Rapid Deployment Forces in Shirouma and continue to build an international basis.
Also, continue to maintain as valid economic sanctions against Russia.
We can not act directly without the authorization of the Security Council.
Therefore, strongly urge Eurussia to propose a provision laying face resign Stalin and his government, so that they can be prosecuted for violating international law.
They have violated the rules, and not simple enough excuses to turn back.
Shirouma and the entire region deserves justice.
Only then, when in Russia there will be a new government, we'll alliances and investments.
Therefore, we continue to ask Eurussia, our good ally, to intervene immediately.
This is not diplomacy or war, it is pure and simple desire for peace, justice and stability.
Things that Russia has broken and violated shamelessly, and will continue to do so, if we do not move, or better, if Eurussia does not move.
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Re: WAAF General Meeting

Post  Great Eurussia on Thu Aug 08, 2013 11:26 pm

United States of Europe wrote:For the moment, all that the WAAF is able to do is keep active the air and sea blockade, keep operating the Rapid Deployment Forces in Shirouma and continue to build an international basis.
Also, continue to maintain as valid economic sanctions against Russia.
We can not act directly without the authorization of the Security Council.
Therefore, strongly urge Eurussia to propose a provision laying face resign Stalin and his government, so that they can be prosecuted for violating international law.
They have violated the rules, and not simple enough excuses to turn back.
Shirouma and the entire region deserves justice.
Only then, when in Russia there will be a new government, we'll alliances and investments.
Therefore, we continue to ask Eurussia, our good ally, to intervene immediately.
This is not diplomacy or war, it is pure and simple desire for peace, justice and stability.
Things that Russia has broken and violated shamelessly, and will continue to do so, if we do not move, or better, if Eurussia does not move.
Eurussia will only support sanctions and intervention on Communist Russia if there is credible evidence that their government's actions and policies are against world peace.
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